After 25 years in retail lending, Smith says he once believed wholesale lending was unscrupulous and unreliable. His view changed after Fannie Mae data showed no major performance difference between retail and wholesale, while UWM demonstrated stronger process, technology, liquidity, and client service than he had associated with the channel.

Pre-crisis closing failures shaped long memories about wholesale lending
Smith says Fannie Mae data did not show a major retail-wholesale difference
He credits UWM with adding credibility and liquidity to wholesale
He now urges consumers to speak with a broker before choosing

“you spent 25 years doing retail you know you truly believe in your soul retail is the only way and that wholesale is bad”
Desmond Smith · 06:00

“the data showed there was no major difference at all between retail and wholesale”
Desmond Smith · 09:30

#wholesale lending#retail lending#mortgage brokers

Hot Take· 1

Hot Take28:30

Smith's AI Test: Faster and Cheaper Without Sacrificing Experience

Smith expects mortgage institutions to explore AI for underwriting, quality control, fraud prevention, and customer experience, although he does not claim knowledge of government plans. His performance test for UWM's investment is that technology should make work faster and cheaper while preserving a high level of client experience.

He expects AI exploration across the mortgage industry
Potential uses include underwriting, quality assurance, and fraud prevention
UWM was making major technology investments to lead rather than follow
Speed and cost improvements should not degrade client experience

“I think the kind of the uh reach of AI we don't even fully grasp right yet”
Desmond Smith · 29:30

“faster cheaper with a high level of client experience”
Desmond Smith · 30:00

#artificial intelligence#mortgage technology#client experience

Explainer· 1

Explainer19:30

The Mental Shift Smith Had to Make From B2C to B2B

Smith says moving from Fannie Mae to UWM was less about relearning mortgages than changing how he thought about acquiring business. In direct-to-consumer lending he focused on Realtors and referral partners who would send borrowers; at UWM, success meant equipping broker partners to grow and create experiences that generate more referrals.

His primary and secondary mortgage experience transferred to UWM
The unfamiliar part was thinking in B2B rather than B2C terms
UWM's success depends on brokers winning and growing share
Better broker experiences can generate partner and customer referrals

“there is a big difference in direct to Consumer versus B2B”
Desmond Smith · 20:00

“success for us at WM is that the Brokers are winning Brokers are growing share”
Desmond Smith · 20:30

#b2b#b2c#business model

Story· 1

Story02:30

How a Summer Job Became Smith's 33-Year Mortgage Career

Smith says he never planned to enter mortgages and expected to become a corporate attorney. A summer job at FHA exposed him to underwriting at 19, beginning a career that later included Wells Fargo, JPMorgan Chase, Citibank, Fannie Mae, and UWM.

He started at FHA between his freshman and sophomore years
Senior FHA specialists taught him 203(k) and credit underwriting
He moved into sales after college because he wanted to earn more
His career later crossed major banks, the secondary market, and wholesale lending

“I started was in between my freshman and sophomore year in college I started working for FHA as a summer job”
Desmond Smith · 02:30

“I've never in my life growing up thought I'd be in the mortgage business”
Desmond Smith · 04:30

#career#mortgages#underwriting

Q&A· 2

Q&A12:30

The Three Leaders Who Shape Smith's Thinking

Smith names Mat Ishbia, Oprah Winfrey, and Jamie Dimon as distinct sources of inspiration. He admires Ishbia's drive to help brokers win, Winfrey's commitment to lifting people up, and Dimon's business mind and disciplined follow-through.

He calls Ishbia the best mortgage mind because of his drive and passion to win
He admires Winfrey's message of helping people get the best from themselves
He sees Dimon as a leading global banking mind
Dimon's folded-paper system tracked obligations in both directions

“Matt's the best because you know what he is he's driven and he's passionate drive and passion to win”
Desmond Smith · 13:00

“her message of always trying to lift people up”
Desmond Smith · 13:30

#inspiration#leadership#business

Q&A32:00

Smith's Three Goals: Weight, Market Share, and Time With Each Twin

Smith gives one goal in each of three areas. He wants to keep his weight around 210 pounds, help brokers reach 25% annual market share, and complete five individual experiences with each of his 10-year-old twins so they receive time apart from their usual shared activities.

His personal goal centers on maintaining his preferred weight
His professional goal is 25% broker market share for the year
His family goal tracks five individual activities with each child
The experiences can be simple, such as an hour at an art studio

“my personal goal is to stay right between like 210 lbs”
Desmond Smith · 32:00

“to try and spend some more quality time with each of my kids individually”
Desmond Smith · 33:30

#goals#market share#family time

Takeaway· 3

Takeaway16:00

Smith's Three Reasons for Choosing His UWM Role

Smith wanted three things from his next role: experience at a non-bank, a place on a winning team, and a seat at the decision-making table. UWM also gave him what he calls clarity of purpose because the company focuses on helping brokers win in mortgages rather than treating the business as a small division among many.

His previous career had centered on large banks
He wanted mortgage success to define the team's win
He wanted direct access to the decision-making table
A narrow business focus created clarity of purpose

“there was three reasons I wanted to work for a non-bank”
Desmond Smith · 16:00

“we're not trying to do appraisals not trying to do title not trying to do nothing else but Mortgage business and make sure Brokers can…”
Desmond Smith · 17:00

#career decisions#purpose#winning teams

Takeaway18:00

Smith's Standard for His Children: Give Fully and Be Good People

Smith says his central hopes are that his twins become good people who contribute to society and give full effort to what they choose. He pairs that standard with love and practical support, such as throwing a football with his son rather than expecting performance without helping.

He wants his children to give to society rather than take
He focuses on effort after mistakes in sports
He asks children to examine what they could do better
High expectations are paired with love and support

“I want my kids to be two good people two good people who give to society versus take that's all I ask”
Desmond Smith · 18:00

“it's just making sure that they they know they're loved and that they know they're supported”
Desmond Smith · 19:00

#parenting#effort#character

Takeaway27:00

After Surviving 2022–23, Smith Says It Is Time to Grow

Smith characterizes 2022 and 2023 as an exceptionally hard mortgage environment because of rapidly rising rates, affordability problems, and low inventory. For originators who survived it, he says the mindset should now move from hunkering down to growth through social media, clearer storytelling, consumer acquisition, and new referral agents.

Rapid rate increases combined with affordability and inventory challenges
Survival demonstrated resilience through a severe market
The next phase should focus on growth rather than continued retreat
Originators need to understand and communicate who they are

“you survive 2022 and 2023 you in my opinion made it through the worst”
Desmond Smith · 27:30

“it was hunker down now it's about let's build it up”
Desmond Smith · 28:00

#growth mindset#mortgage market#social media

Frameworks in this episode

Morning Mind-Reset Routine

Proof-Led Market Education

Purchase Foundation, Refi Layer

Whole-Person Leadership Loop

Insights & moments

⚡Myth Buster· 1

Why a Retail Veteran Changed His View of Mortgage Brokers

◆Hot Take· 1